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Overheard in the Lounge

Current Issue:                                         (previous issue)     (past issue)

Are supplements really dangerous?

Dr. Milton: Did you see the article in Consumer's Report about some supplements being dangerous?

Dr. Edwards: Yes, I did. But I don't know of any patients that use the ones they listed, except maybe Yohimbe.

Dr. Milton: I have some patients that take that and say it's effective in helping them rejuvenate their desire.

Dr. Edwards: That's probably the placebo effect.

Dr. Ruth: I have a lot of patients that seem to take the various herbal supplements and I basically don't get involved.

Dr. Michelle: I don't either because I know very little about them and I don't want to appear uninformed in front of my patients.

Dr. Paul: My pediatric patients, or rather their mothers, don't seem to use much in the way of herbs.

Dr. Rosen: So where do we stand on food supplements?

Dr. Edwards: It seems to be a moving target with changing goals that seem to confuse patients and their doctors.

Dr. Milton: I'm sure we all read the stories in the various newspapers and journals. Sometimes the anecdotal stories found in the general press keep us conversant with the times we live in.

Dr. Edwards: We could possibly keep a Health Letter around to educate our patients with some solid reading material.

Dr. Rosen: And educate ourselves also.

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Previous Issue:                                         (current issue)     (past issue)


Did Hell Freeze Over last night?

Reading an article in the newspaper on the table in the Staff Lounge: "President Obama has appointed a commission on the federal debt (National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform), mainly focused on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. To signal his seriousness about this venture, the president has even gone so far as to put the newly passed health reform bill on the negotiating table - although the ink on the new law is barely dry."

Dr. Rosen: Is there really Ice on the Ground in DC in July?

Dr. Sam: I'll believe that when DC really freezes over in July.

Dr. Edwards: Hey, let me go out and catch a falcon.

Dr. Dave: We are living in a world of fiction.

Dr. Edwards: Maybe the kid in the big White House is growing up and realizing that he can't spend greenbacks as if they were green paper issues.

Dr. Rosen: It truly is a fictitious world. The county is going broke and laying off health care workers and eliminating critical jobs. The cities are going broke and laying off police, firefighters and other safety workers. The states are going broke and closing clinics, cutting university salaries, laying off professors, and limiting the number of students that can enroll. Those that are able to enroll are facing increased tuition and fees.

Dr. Edwards: You don't really think Obama's monstrous health care bill, that will double taxes for our children and triple taxes for our grandchildren, will really be pulled back?

Dr. Paul: I certainly hope not. Everyone is exaggerating the effects.

Dr. Edwards: How can you say that, Paul? Even Obama's own finance director has stated that taxes will have to go up even though they were allegedly supposed to go down.

Dr. Paul: How else though are you going to cover the poor?

Dr. Dave: Well, don't we have the huge Medicaid program for all poor people?

Dr. Paul: Why am I seeing so many children whose parents have a difficult time paying their bills?

Dr. Dave: Don't most of your patients already have Medicaid?

Dr. Paul: There are more Medicaid patients standing in line waiting to be seen.

Dr. Dave: If you have a waiting list for Medicaid patients already, what's going to happen when the president puts another 35 million people into the program?

Dr. Paul:  At least they will be covered and have an even chance of being seen.

Dr. Sam: Isn't that what the lawsuit that went to the Canadian Supreme Court a couple of years ago was all about?

Dr. Paul: How's that?

Dr. Sam: The patient was in severe pain and after waiting two years for a hip arthroplasty was still not able to obtain care, so he took his case all the way to the Canadian Supreme Court.

Dr. Rosen: Yes, wasn't that interesting. The patient and his doctor knew they had the court exactly where they couldn't move in another direction. After completing all the arguments, the Supreme Court waited a full year to give its report: Canadian Medicare does not give access to health care; it only gives access to a waiting list. *

Dr. Sam: And if Obama is successful in implementing his outrageous plan, which doubles the number in Medicaid, all the new Medicaid patients, plus all the current Medicaid patients, will no longer have any better access to health care, similar to Canadian Medicare. So we've gone the disastrous way of Canada through the back door. The 30 million or so current Medicaid recipients have moved from access to care to access to the waiting list, and the 35 million or so new Medicaid recipients will now have access to a waiting list. They will probably be worse off than they are now in receiving care.

Dr. Rosen: Getting back to Paul's statement of how his Medicaid patients have difficulty with their finances, have you had informal discussions with them before or after your appointments? Or escorted them to their cars?

Dr. Paul: I'm too rushed to have that kind of talk.

Dr. Rosen: My Medicaid patients frequently have two cars and live in upscale locales.

Dr. Edwards: It looks like a matter of priorities. If you sit at home most of the time watching TV, wouldn't you want a 60-inch flat screen?

Dr. Sam: Sometimes it's enlightening to escort patients to their car to see what they are driving. I'd say the most expensive cars in our doctor's lot are about equally divided between the Medicaid and so-called middle class patients.

Dr. Rosen: I once tried to accompany a patient to the car and he stopped in the hallway and asked what I was doing. He invited me to return to my office. So I turned to go back to my office and a minute later followed from a distance as I watched him get into a late model Jaguar and drive off.

Dr. Sam: So you were seeing him for half your usual fee and he's driving a car twice as expensive as you are driving.

Dr. Edwards: It helps when you have several sources of income and the government doesn't know about two of them.

Dr. Rosen: It also explains a doctor's perception of welfare and government largess while getting blamed for insensitivity or greed.

* --Canadian Supreme Court Decision 2005 SCC 35, [2005] 1 S.C.R. 791 http://scc.lexum.umontreal.ca/en/2005/2005scc35/2005scc35.html

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Past Issue:                                         (current issue)     (previous issue)

Will your practice close with ObamaCare in 2013?

Dr. Rosen: What will our practices be like in 2013, only three years from now, when the full impact of ObamaCare will go into effect?

Dr. Sam: I plan to opt out of all government programs.

Dr. Dave: I'm hoping to do the same. Only I'm a little nervous about making any drastic moves.

Dr. Edwards: I'm with Dave. I want to drop out but fear retribution by the government.

Dr. Ruth: What kind of retribution?

Dr. Edwards: I'm not sure. I'm not sure Congress knows. But they will think of something if they think physicians are thwarting their plans for expanding healthcare.

Dr. Yancy: I'm essentially out of government controlling me and I will just proceed with seeing private patients.

Dr. Ruth: What if you won't have enough private patients?

Dr. Yancy: That's always the risk you have to take. Just like when we started decades ago. The government has always made it harder and harder but we've survived.

Dr. Ruth: You don't think you'll ever have to change course back again?

Dr. Yancy: Are you crazy? I'd never stoop to be a government whore again.

Dr. Paul: Those are pretty strong words, Yancy.

Dr. Yancy: You think we are still in the middle ages? Welcome to the real world.

Dr. Rosen: We thought the New World was the Real World in the 18th and 19th century. But in the last 75 years the New World has regressed to the old world or old Europe. Our generation has nearly forgotten the degree of freedom we accomplished in the first century and a half, a good share of which we've lost in the last three-quarter century.

Dr. Paul: I still feel I am free to practice medicine. In my pediatric practice, most of my patients could not afford me unless they have Medicaid. That's been a boon to care for our children.

Dr. Edwards: I don't think we can do justice to all the implications of that statement during a 20-minute lunch. The government programs may be just as much at fault in creating poverty as in managing poverty.

Dr. Milton: Is there going to be any momentum to those signs that started popping up in doctor's offices in Arizona?

Dr. Michelle: What signs?

Dr. Milton:  The advance notice to patients that if ObamaCare is not repealed by Congress or ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court by 2013 when the full effects are felt, then "This office will close."

Dr. Paul: I don't think you can frighten the government like that. Do you think the government will care?

Dr. Milton: Of course not. Congress has nearly unlimited powers now to limit and restrict freedom including the freedom to practice one's own profession.

Dr. Rosen: They think they can tell doctors through the CMS how to treat patients appropriately and if they do so, and it produces a bad result, still hold the doctor guilty of malpractice.

Dr. Milton: Nice work if you can get it.

Dr. Rosen: A Catch 22.

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